|
|
Post by mikey on Apr 5, 2011 18:53:49 GMT -5
The thing that jumps out at me, more than anything, is that there aren't really any STORIES going on now, besides the Rafe2/DiMera stuff. I know part of that is transitional, but I think it's reflecting in the ratings -- you can check in on any given day, check out some character interactions, but not be compelled to tune in for any particular thing the next day. I think that's why I enjoyed the Rafe2/Fay showdown so much on Friday: it felt like real momentum to push stuff along. Everyone else is kind of drifting: Chloe is recovering, Melanie's sparring with Dario and getting over her other failed relationships, Jen and Daniel are bonding nicely, Maggie and Victor are getting along, Vivian is up to some stupid, vague scheme, etc. There's just not much story drive. The Parker story was pretty classic soap in how it roped in a lot of characters and had some stakes -- they need some more stuff like that.
|
|
|
|
Post by addictedtodool on Apr 6, 2011 10:29:33 GMT -5
That's true Mikey. Plus it's getting warmer and folks want to get outside and you need somethingmore compelling to make them watch. I don't think that Rafe2 is not compelling, I think that becaase EJ is the new central character on the show, The DiMeras are the new "Hortons" in terms of airtime. EJ is carrying two storylines right now and other charachters are suffering for it. When ratings were better, Brady was getting more airtime...What's Brady doing anymore? Propping up the Dario storyline. I could go forever without having to watch Dario. I am invested in the Rafe2 storyline, and am glad it has begun to move forward, but I think Rafe1 doesn't get anough airtime either. ANd I agree that things are just too dark and foreboding for this time of year... Spring is for love and happiness. Should have given us more Justin and Adrienne and less Danko/ Dario.
I think the fact that Philip is leaving has hurt. They are trying not to showcase his character, so we don't see him interacting with Brady about Titan and the takeover. He doesn't chat with Kate and is only seen here and there in regards to Chloe and Parker. As much as we love Parker, I have a feeling he will not be around for long. Too many kids already. NOt that they aren't cute, but they do inhibit storylines in some ways. Like with Bo and Hope...we are getting Ciarra and Theo instead of Bo and Hope. I think Days is off the tracks in so many ways, there isn't one thing that can save days except for a really good romance. And all we've got is Tay and EJ. Or something totally surprising...like a quick Rafe escape and kim killing Rafe 2 AND EJ and Nicole being saved by Brad ;Dy with a wonderful traditional wedding to follow. In New Orleans.
|
|
|
|
Post by Tom Horton on Apr 6, 2011 12:19:59 GMT -5
Interesting discussion and good points from all.
If I had to narrow it down to the one central problem for Days, I would say it is that the foundation of the show has been eroded to the point that long time fans have increasingly fewer reasons to remain attached to the show and that same lack of foundation makes it impossible for the show to pull off any worthwhile storyline that might bring in new viewers. Soap operas are epic story telling and that requires a core set of characters with unique, developed personalities that motivates their decisions, creates/destroys their relationships and drives storylines. It seems to me that Days has been determined over the past few years to do the exact opposite. They keep trying to rely on only a few "main" characters instead of an ensemble cast and making characters fit the plot instead of the other way around. When that happens frequently enough, it lessens the bond that the audience has with the character and when that happens with enough characters, it decreases the bond that the audience has to the show. Meanwhile, new characters and damaged veteran characters with new and/or diminished relationships to one another can not sell even the best of storylines. The same core problem eats away at both the longtime fanbase and the ability of the show to appeal to new customers.
IMO, Tomlin came in with a plan to switch out veteran characters for new ones played by cheaper actors, believing that if he could just find the right mixture of new and vet characters and keep the audience hanging on with promises of better things to come (like returning vets that never got fully utilized) and strategically planned shock and awe gimmicks, he could maintain the same ratings at a cheaper cost. In 2009, I'd say that he managed to do just that but those gimmicks had a short shelf life and when he decided to implement the next phase of his plan (firing Bryan Dattilo and pushing Safe as the new "It" couple by having Sami temporarily placed back in storyline with EJ and making that the main focus of the show) it all came crumbling down in flames. He terribly miscalculated the audience's reaction to that storyline and the show was not able to fully recover through the usually higher ratings period of the Fall and Winter. Ratings definitely improved during that time but not nearly enough to put it back where it was in February 2010. Now is the time of year when Days and other soaps start to see a dip in ratings, only this isn't a dip, it is the second year in a row that we've witnessed other soaps gaining ratings while Days is falling fast and hard.
My suggestion for improving the ratings is for Tomlin/Days to give up the failed experiment and get back to the practices that made the show successful for 40+ years. Build the show around multiple, well established characters (played by talented and therefore gasp! expensive actors - you get what you pay for), focus on their individual character development and all types of relationships with other characters and let that solid foundation serve to drive and root the storylines. The way to offset the increased cost of better actors is to get rid of the many lesser ones that have come on in recent years ... have a smaller but skilled and fully used cast.
|
|
|
|
Post by addictedtodool on Apr 6, 2011 13:42:06 GMT -5
Boy I sure wish they'd listen you you Kazz.
|
|
|
|
Post by mikey on Apr 6, 2011 15:10:26 GMT -5
Generally agree with you, Kazz. I'll take issue with one thing, though: My suggestion for improving the ratings is for Tomlin/Days to give up the failed experiment and get back to the practices that made the show successful for 40+ years. Build the show around multiple, well established characters (played by talented and therefore gasp! expensive actors - you get what you pay for), focus on their individual character development and all types of relationships with other characters and let that solid foundation serve to drive and root the storylines. The way to offset the increased cost of better actors is to get rid of the many lesser ones that have come on in recent years ... have a smaller but skilled and fully used cast. The cast is already pretty damn small. I mean, they could of course cut a few people here and there, but it's not like it's super-bloated. And I'm not sure cutting everyone but Bo, Hope, Jennifer, Jack, Sami, and Lucas would make for a better show, honestly. There has to be a balance. I mean, if you can cut a Chad and a Gabi to pay for a Jack, then totally. But I don't want to see Melanie, Chloe, Nicole, Brady, Carly, Vivian, and whoever else go just so we can have, like, Marlena back on the screen. |
|
|
|
Post by Tom Horton on Apr 6, 2011 15:28:44 GMT -5
Rest assured Mikey, if it were up to me and it most certainly is not ... I would not cut Nicole, Brady, Carly or Vivian nor would I bring back Marlena. Truth be told, I wouldn't be interested in bringing back my fave Lucas right away either and Sami is another fave that I recognize as being one of those in need of a hiatus. I agree with the need for balance and wasn't calling for a complete overhaul. I could list out exactly who I would cut, keep and bring back but I'm sure we all have varying ideas on that and without making the necessary changes in administrative practices, casting changes is a little like rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. I will tell you that if I were Corday, I would start by firing Tomlin.... of course if I were Corday, I'd fire myself second.  |
|
|
|
Post by mikey on Apr 6, 2011 16:28:15 GMT -5
I wonder if Tomlin would be better if paired with a headwriter with a more interesting vision. I know the rumor is that he sort of rules the ship and Higley just does what she's told, but this show has her stamp all over it (and I'm one of the ones generally enjoying it). Tomlin HAS kept the show within its budget and on the air, for which I'll pretty grateful.
|
|
|
|
Post by slyn11 on Apr 7, 2011 14:16:39 GMT -5
Too many new couples starting all at the same time. People need something to root for. If you change all the couples every 3 years with no hope for the broken up couples people tune out. Great soaps have characters deal with the aftermath of love as well as starting new romances. Also stories need to have a point. The show did a really good job telling a a cohesive well plotted story with Baby switch/Sydnapping (involved Nicole, Brady, EJ, Sami, Rafe, Will, Anna, Faye, Arianna, Chad, Mia, Dr. Baker, Stefano) and Philip/Melanie (Involved Philip, Melanie, Nick, Max,Trent, Victor, Maggie, Nathan, Stephanie, Chloe, Daniel, Kate, Vivian, Carly, Bo, Hope, Dr. Baker, Caroline, Ian) that used tons of the cast and created character growth. The ratings were good during this time. Then when those two stories finally ended it all fell apart. It was like the show didn't have any other stories set up for when these two ended. Now we are back to lots of little individual stories that don't connect the characters to each other. I guess I should end this by saying...I never enjoyed Days in my life as much as I did from 2008 until maybe Feb. 2011. I think soaps are like jeans, all brands don't fit every body. Days is definitely a hard fit for me, because I much prefer the darker characters and stories found on shows like GH. But it does explain why I am a Philip fan.  |
|
|
|
Post by Tom Horton on Apr 7, 2011 14:57:18 GMT -5
@slyn, my relationship with Days is essentially the opposite. I loved it from the 80s until about 2008.... but my disappointment in Days led me to discover GH, which I now love (GH is doing great in the ratings right now and for good reason). Oddly enough, in spite of the profession of a few, I don't find those characters or the stories nearly as dark as the way so many are now written on Days. Days just feels overwhelmed with darkness (and worse, stupidity) to me, whereas GH is filled with touching moments and thoughtful dialogue between characters in spite of the sometimes shady happenings. I think it goes back to the lack of balance on Days that has been mentioned several times in this thread. I definitely enjoy the gray characters (like Philip) best myself.
ETA: I meant to add that one of the things I particularly enjoyed in your post and agree with is the remark about fans needing something to root for. They do and they also need to get a pay off that lasts more than 5 seconds at the end of it too. Constantly frustrating fans and making them feel like there is no point in getting invested in any character or couple because it won't last means they have very little incentive to invest in the show itself.
|
|
|
|
Post by addictedtodool on Apr 7, 2011 15:03:59 GMT -5
Pay off. Good way of putting it Kazz. I say just let us enjoy it for more than a minute. It's like getting a whiff of the dessert cart and never getting to take a bite.  |
|
|
|
Post by MrsM on Apr 7, 2011 15:05:22 GMT -5
I feel the same way. Just when I started to get invested in Phillip and Melanie and Daniel and Chloe, they yanked the rug out from under me. I am afraid to get attached to Victor and Maggie and to even start to like Daniel and Jennifer, because I feel like if I like it, they are just going to take it away from me. What drew me to the show is no longer even in existence and it is frustrating. I watch it more out of habit now than out of needing to see what happens next. When I was working I never watched the show, I just read summaries. Now I can watch and I don't feel like I missed anything by not being able to watch.
|
|
|
|
Post by slyn11 on Apr 7, 2011 15:28:40 GMT -5
@slyn, my relationship with Days is essentially the opposite. I loved it from the 80s until about 2008.... but my disappointment in Days led me to discover GH, which I now love (GH is doing great in the ratings right now and for good reason). Oddly enough, in spite of the profession of a few, Aww I love hearing about new GH fans. I have been watching that show since I was in the first grade - some of my oldest TV memories are from GH. The current storyline on GH is so heartwrenching for me. I have been there since the beginning for all these characters...so all the pain just hurts even more. It is like you said payoff...GH goes in for the kill and stays to watch the carnage and the aftermath. Days just sets up these events and lets them unfold and then starts fresh at the end. The aftermath is a crucial part of the story. Case in point, Chloe's ppd - there was no reason for all that to have been told in one month. More time should have been taken. I know certain players were leaving - but all that stuff was filmed BEFORE JKJ decided to leave. So really the show had no excuse with how they chose to tell the story. Same with EJ being shot in the head by Sami. That head wound should have had some sort of effect on his personality...at least temporarily. What a waste for Days to write that and have EJ back to normal in a few days. Same with Johnny's cancer.... |
|
|
|
Post by tabbycat46 on Apr 8, 2011 7:31:24 GMT -5
Good morning everyone, did anyone else see the most recent ratings (3/28-4/1)? Days has hit another new low:
6. DAYS 2,228,000 (-133,000/-294,000) * <---- new low. The day to day ratings are:
Monday: 1.7/2,288,000
Tuesday: 1.8/2,436,000
Wednesday: 1.7/2,382,000
Thursday: 1.7/2,416,000
Friday: 1.4/1,917,000
Things don't look really good for the future of Days unless there are major changes in the areas of production and writing. Hopefully, KC will do the right thing and clean house. There isn't one single storyline airing that has any merit, except maybe Carly's.
|
|
|
|
Post by DancingDays on Apr 8, 2011 8:50:57 GMT -5
With ratings so low so much of the time, I can't help but wonder, are TPTB even paying attention to ratings? Do they care? Are they doing any kind of self-analysis to try to figure out a way to make the ratings go up? *sigh* Somehow I doubt it. They are determined to forge ahead with stories we hate, and for what? To completely alienate ALL of their remaining viewers? Smh. (<-- means "shaking my head" in case you didn't know)
|
|
|
|
Post by Tom Horton on Apr 8, 2011 10:04:41 GMT -5
They definitely care about ratings esp. when there is a coinciding drop in ratings among certain demographics (women 18-49), but like with any business it isn't one or two (or now three) bad weeks, it's what is the pattern over time. If I were a consultant for Days, I would be more interested in having them look at the ratings patterns over the past five years than the past 3 weeks... and I would make a special point of showing them the steady rise through most of 2009 that peaked with Days at 2nd place the week of Feb. 8, 2010 and then the sharp decline from that point forward through the summer, the only slight increases for the Fall/Winter and now another decline. So what did they do/not do in the spring of 2010 that caused this ongoing negative pattern for them. As a Lucas fan, I'd like to point out that the week of Feb. 8, 2010 was his last big week on the show (he had one more scene the following week) and as popular as I think he truly is (not just my own personal bias) so were John, Marlena, Tony, Anna, Steve & Kayla and for a longer time period so my suggestion is more that it was the cummulative effect of all of those lost veterans, combined with a shift in the show's frontrunning storyline.
While Nicole was the primary focus through 2009, the ratings were steadily good. Once they shifted the storyline to the EJ/Rafe/Sami trio the ratings went south. Personally, I don't think they would have gone down quite so fast if they hadn't moved Sami into DiMansion and had her lose her mind and spine again (I tried to warn them that would be a disaster), but at this point I would strongly suggest that Days let go of the notion that either EJ or Rafe can be "leads" for the show. And as much as I love(d) my girl Sami, the character isn't meant to serve the "lead" role they've been trying to shove her into. I don't think the "lead" practice they've been utilizing the last couple of years would work for any soap with any characters, but it definitely doesn't work to try to recreate the John/Marlena/Stefano dynamic with Rafe/Sami/EJ. If they want that dynamic again so badly, bring back John & Marlena and stop trying to recreate the classics with cheap substitutes. Personally, I never thought that was an interesting dynamic even with the original players and I'm not suggesting a return to it. I'm suggesting that they build on the strengths of the existing characters, creatively develop new dynamics that work for the show and get rid of characters, relationships, etc. that don't work... but all of that requires competency and talent at administrative levels, so I still see that as the crux of their problem.
|
|
